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What you're saying is completely accurate, but I'd add that it's all relative. Are you falling towards the ground, or is the ground falling towards you? For instance malnutrition lowers IQ, in both directions. There is an inverse correlation between IQ and BMI, but what's most interesting is that that correlation has maintained just as strong even as obesity rates skyrocketed, which is suggestive that there's probably something causal, in some direction, somewhere in there.

And so in modern times if it turns out that eating less than most people apparently want to contributes to IQ, are you doing something good by eating less, or are they doing something bad by eating more? I think it's basically the same thing, just looked at in different ways.

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Or are smarter people better able to regulate their food intake? (Either innately, or because society gives them other privileges which makes them less likely to overeat)
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I would say, that on the whole, this has to do with habituated impulse control and self-restraint.

Classical writers speak of this as well, things like how inordinate and undisciplined appetites (not just for food, mind you; sex, too, and undue acquisitiveness of all sorts, for instance) darken the mind. What is inordinate and undisciplined is not proportioned or directed by reason. So, such character traits are rooted in fidelity to reason which means that not only do they avoid the aforementioned darkening of the mind by moderation of appetite, but the very character strength of being able to do so enables rational existence in other things.

Innate intelligence doesn't secure discipline. Indeed, it gives the person a bigger footgun and allows for more elaborate rationalizations of vice.

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Which then begs the question, what is IQ actually measuring - something more like innate intelligence, or a fairly big slice of learned, habituated test-taking ability?

Regardless of what underlying trait it's actually measuring, the habituation factory is a big component of its supposed bias - that is, has your background taught you the kind of problem-solving habits that will help you to post the best possible score?

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> Which then begs the question, what is IQ actually measuring - something more like innate intelligence, or a fairly big slice of learned, habituated test-taking ability?

This question was asked and answered many decades ago in sociology. Researchers moved onto more interesting topics and fields. IQ tests measure g factor (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G_factor_(psychometrics)).

> "It is a variable that summarizes positive correlations among different cognitive tasks, reflecting the assertion that an individual's performance on one type of cognitive task tends to be comparable to that person's performance on other kinds of cognitive tasks."

In other words people who are good at these tests are also good at real world tasks. Meaning IQ measures much more than one's ability to pass an IQ test. There are of course many examples of poorly structured IQ tests (including people re-taking the same IQ test and doing better at it the second time around). However a well-structured IQ test presenting novel questions (absent popular culture references and trivia) provides a very good approximation of the g factor in almost all cases. This means high IQ is highly correlated with things like income, unemployment, crime, homelessness, addiction, divorce, and many other objectively measurable life outcomes.

There is room for a philosophical debate about what g factor is, but it is beyond contest at this stage that g factor is real, and IQ almost always does a very good job of measuring it.

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It's beyond contest that the g factor is real in part because it's a statistical inevitability in any series of related tests, be they for intelligence or product/market fit in automobiles. It's an exploratory statistic, a hint at underlying causality; it is not a dispositive revelation about the structure of human thought.

Sure: there's a battery of general cognitive tests, and if you smush data sets together a dominant factor will emerge. And?

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This is exactly my point. It's tautological to argue that IQ isn't correlated with intelligence. It is, definitionally. You seem to acknowledge this so perhaps I don't understand your original comment.
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I just don't think there's anything meaningful about that. Group of related tests is related. Ok, now what?
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(I misread your original comment --- no, it's not tautological. It's tautological to say that IQ isn't correlated with IQ test results. "g" has nothing to do with "intelligence" as a construct.)
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If IQ tests measure one's ability to do most other cognitively demanding tasks then it's measuring more than the test itself. Whatever you want to call that thing is irrelevant. In sociology and psychology we call that the g factor. The vast majority of people call that intelligence.
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That's the tautological argument! Note that I'm not even really engaging with the validity of IQ tests, just the surface logic that you're using. You literally just argued, in effect, that IQ tests measure intelligence because people call them intelligence tests!
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That's a semantic point you're making, and I'm not contesting it. To repeat myself, you can call the correlation anything you like. I'm merely explaining that the correlation exists and is incredibly material.
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We agree the correlation exists. The incredible materiality of it is what's in dispute. The obvious problem with these arguments is that people point to the correlation and say "see, I'm right about the materiality!".
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We have strong data to show that people who score higher on IQ tests also earn more, have higher net wealth, have lower rates of unemployment, higher graduation rates, lower suicide rates, lower rates of addiction, lower rates of crime, lower rates of divorce, lower rates of fatherlessness, lower rates of household abuse, higher rates of home ownership, longer life spans, have better general health on almost every metric, and a host of other positive QoL indicators. I don't see how you could argue that is not material.
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We were talking about psychometric G. I don't know what it is you're trying to talk about now.
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I continue to talk about IQ, IQ tests, and g factor.
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> which is suggestive that there's probably something causal, in some direction, somewhere in there.

Perhaps suggestive, but far from conclusive (I know you know this too). To me, it is suggestive that there is likely some other factor that may explain the relationship better, but then again, I am wrong more often than right, so what do I know? ;)

For example, compare that to growing wealth inequality, and I wouldn't be surprised if that is a potential factor. Less income = less access to care, less access to healthier food options, perhaps less time to for self-care, etc., and if wealth/career potential is gatekept by academic achievement, economic utility, or intelligence, then I can see the two, intelligence and BMI, being correlated, but not directly causal. Though, no study would give people large sums of money to improve their lives, so I doubt we will know for certain.

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The point is not that it is something hard to compute that we can only approximate. The point is that there is no well-defined heritability independent of the environmental distribution.
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There's no well defined "a rock too heavy for a person to lift" too, but we manage. So, what's the point?
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I am not sure I understand the comparison. But let's say we found out that a rock is too heavy for a person to lift on Earth. Does it mean that it is too heavy to lift on the moon? No. And if we find out that something is or is not heritable, does it mean that in new circumstances such as a new policy or some sort of change of norms the heritability will stay the same? No. That's something that many people find counterintuitive.
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I have no problem finding whether this rock is too heavy to lift for me in these specific circumstances. But if we try to define if it's too heavy in general, it becomes not well defined. Specific traits have causal development pathways that theoretically should allow to predict genes/environment interaction, but heritability uses population-level statistics.
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This is demonstrably untrue. IQ has increased consistently for decades, far faster than genetic factors can explain. Environmental factors like education, nutrition, and medical care are the obvious explanation.
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Maybe across the whole population because most people were struggling to eat enough and received almost no education.

If we compared average modern humans against average well fed and educated ones from 200 years ago would that still hold up? I suspect the average college educated human from 1800 would obliterate the average college educated human from 2026.

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how does one separate "doing good" and "stop doing harm"?

I'd personally count nutrition squarely in the second category

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The recent marathon world records are apparently due to improved nutrition.

Here's the producer of the hydrogels talking about the exact process of getting the maximum carbohydrates into the runner:

https://maurten.no/blogs/m-magazine/how-sabastian-sawe-fuele...

> At the elite level, marathon performance is defined by energy availability as much as physiology.

> Maintaining a pace of 2:50 per kilometer requires a constant supply of fuel. Even small disruptions in energy delivery can result in significant time loss.

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coppsilgold is the one who made a hard-line, clear-cut dichotomy when they said "it's easy to do harm [but] it's all but impossible to do any good". bglazer referenced several interventions that are known to increase IQ which challenge this dichotomy. Saying that it is difficult to separate "doing good" and "stop doing harm" is agreeing with the point that coppsilgold created a distinction without a difference.
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This also assumes that IQ testing has remained static. It has not. IQ tests continue to evolve and there are >1 of them and they do not all agree. I.E. the tests themselves might be responsible for some of the variance.
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Also we are past that. Now IQ started decreasing.
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it's hard to separate IQ decreasing and return to mean with IQ stabilizing

in 20th century most of the world moved past famine and toxins - did any factor of similar scale happen in 21st century as well to start looking for opposite processes?

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Generally that statistic refers to populations in isolation, not the entire world in aggregate.

It is fairly well agreed upon that American kids across the nation are currently testing lower than they were in 2010.

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> while it's easy to do harm (lead exposure) it's all but impossible to do any good.

That's just a meaningless statement no different from "while it's easy to subtract negative numbers, it's all but impossible to add positive numbers."

> or non-systematic (results from non-linear interaction of environment and genes).

Non-linear interaction does not mean non-systematic. Computer programs are fully deterministic (and therefore "systematic") while being non-linear (and therefore generally unpredictable). It is true to say that when things are non-linear it's hard to tell with certainty what effect some policy will have, but given that most human systems are non-linear, this is true for just about everything.

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