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> What % of Android users actually want this? Do they know or care?

If Apple announced that they were going to allow installing apps like how you can install APKs you will have a whole group of people on here arguing against it because they want Apple to have control over everything. You could have seen those people in action on the Epic v. Apple and Digital Markets Act discussions.

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Being able to side load apps was why I switched to android 10 years ago
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Please call it what it is and always has been:

   I.N.S.T.A.L.L.I.N.G   S.O.F.T.W.A.R.E
"side load" is like "jay walking' seeks to stigmatize humans being human.
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Same. If Google does this, my next phone will be an iPhone. Freedom is the only reason to put up with Android's shittiness. If they turn it into a walled garden, then we'll choose the better kept garden and it sure as hell isn't Google's.
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What? So you dont value freedom at all? Theres other alternatives too.. graphene, lineage
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Yeah. Computing freedom to have a root shell and do as I please is the entire reason I put up with Android. Google is positioning Android to just be nothing more than a worse iOS. There's pretty much no point to it anymore.
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I switched from iOS to Android about three years ago. I saved all the APKs for everything I installed (or updated) on that first phone. When I got a new phone last fall it was pleasantly like getting a new PC. I imported my SMS and contacts from my last backup (taken with an open source took I'd installed from an APK), then installed all the apps I use and imported or manually set any settings I wanted to customize.

Every non-stock app on my phone was installed from an APK directly downloaded from the manufacturer or open source developer's site / Github releases. I've never had a Google Play account and have never used any Android "app store".

The biggest pain was having to manually logon the couple of sites I allow to keep persistent cookies since device owners aren't allowed to just import/export cookies from mobile Chrome.

It has been a very nice experience. I appreciate the feeling of sovereignty and ownership of my device (even though it does have a locked bootloader and I don't actually have root).

Of course Google would take this away. >sigh<

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Rounded to the nearest percent, I'd guess power users make up 0% of android user base.
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Android is becoming more Apple-ized everyday; it's horrible and more and more APIs get neutered or disappear, further limiting functionality available to developers.
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> What % of Android users actually want this? Do they know or care?

2%, according to the keepandroidopen.org poll[^1]

[^1] https://techhub.social/@keepandroidopen/116251892296272830

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Do we think that maybe the 3,732 people who responded to a poll on Mastodon by an account centered around one side of this disagreement might potentially not be a representative sample of all Android users?
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Sampling bias.
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Perhaps. And yet … 98% opposition from 4K respondents? I'd be very surprised to see any other poll that tilts the other way, regardless of sampling bias.
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But but but it is for your security! You need to be protected!

Android isn't open source for a while. They started by pushing device certification which crippled any abilities of OEMs to make a better framework. Then they took many of the opensource packages out of android and redistributed as applications that they controlled via play services.

Then they made it harder to publish packages and created tons of rules that they can arbitrarily decide to cut ties with you or remove your remuneration.

What they are effectively doing now is to remove any ability of individual developers to push applications. Some will say the costs ain't that high, but (1) maybe not in USD dollars for Americans and (2) both Google and Apple will push those numbers way up high soon.

Even if that is not the case, if you don't agree with anything and you decide to have your own version of your family wiki, messenger or anything, they will be able to tell the authorities about it.

This is insane....

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It would be good if there was less malware and outright scams in the play store but that's really orthogonal to the developer verification issue.
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Not sure why your observation was received poorly. It's true. If they actually wanted to fight bad actors they could (for example) introduce a voluntary verification program where an app cost $$$ per year to list, is permitted only a fixed number of updates per year, and the uploads are manually audited by an actual person. This would add a second tier to the app store.

Just to drive the point home. Not that you would do this but you _could_ even implement such a system fully anonymously - with uploads via tor and payments via XMR - and it should still work just as well.

Add in a third even more expensive tier for those providing source code to the auditor where google verifies a signed deterministic build the same way fdroid does. Now clearly mark the three different tiers in the app store.

And if they went this route the next logical step for highly sensitive stuff like banking and password management would be a fourth licensed and bonded tier where a verified individual located in a friendly country took on liability for any fraud or other malpractice. That tier would be the equivalent to the situation for civil engineers.

Instead we're stuck in a reality where I don't trust sourcing password managers (among other things) from the play store. Those only ever come from fdroid for me - you know, an actually secure model for how to do app distribution and verify builds.

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You were wrong at percentage. The question is what count would want this.
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> What % of Android users actually want this? Do they know or care?

Bold of you assuming they're doing for users. It's fear-mongering at its finest - using the threat of security to install more control that has little to no protection against the said threats.

Now you might say it's going to raise the bar for the scammers, but nobody is going to be spending time on writing scam or malware for a few bucks. When the reward is high, they can just pay out already verified developers to distribute their builds under their accounts, or just find a workaround (fake ids?) which could be still way cheaper than the potential revenue potential of a successful attack. It's just an inconvenience that didn't existed before.

This is just a policy directly targeting the legit developers distributing apps to work around some of the platform's limitations (ie. uncrappifying youtube). They were previously free to share the workarounds they've developed for themselves since it was just as easy as sharing your APK. Now with added threat of losing your developer account and probably being perma-banned from google, those devs are less likely to continue distributing their workarounds.

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It's not about users, it's about a single judges idiotic ruling that Google play store is a monopoly, and the Apple app store is not.

Different judge you say? You're right. But when Google in their appeal asked the judge why the app store isn't a monopoly, the judge told Google with a straight face

"You can't be anti-competitive if you have no competitors."

Google took note.

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People don't want it until they've been scammed. Then they'll complain why you didn't save them.
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People will erroneously complain about all sorts of things. Doesn't mean you should act.

Anyway in this case it's nothing more than a thinly veiled excuse to justify making ecosystem changes that are in their favor. They aren't acting in good faith.

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Do people complain about being scammed with Windows or macOS? Apparently not. So they probably also don't complain about Android. The security seems more an excuse to become more closed. Like iOS.
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> Do people complain about being scammed with Windows

They do. They absolutely do. Where have you been in the last 20 years? Windows has had a reputation as an unsafe ecosystem for decades. Even amongst non-tech people. And even with the various exploits the biggest source of viruses on windows was always that, lacking a proper channel to distribute applications, they had trained their users to double click any .exe on the internet and the next>next>next in whatever installer. I don't agree with the tightening of developer account requirements, but this argument doesn't hold at all.

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I don't necessarily like the idea of a company wiping their hands clean and saying "well - not our problem!" either though.

Companies shouldn't wait to solve issues like this - they should be proactively helping their most vulnerable users. That is the "do no evil" motto.

I don't know enough to say whether this method is the right approach however.

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>Companies shouldn't wait to solve issues like this

Unless you built your house yourself, you should expect the construction company to be responsible for verifying the identities of anyone entering your house. Asking for a passport and a one time payment, just in case the person who rings the bell may not be a friend.

That should be proactively helping you in case you're a vulnerable homeowner. Not checking in on every visitor would be evil, no?

I can't think of a better approach.

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I lived in an apartment building, and one of the upsides was that the building had a security system and a front desk that helped control who could be wandering down my hall.
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Me too.

But we, owners, collectively choose that. We choose the security company, we pay then, we can vote them out. Most importantly: the construction company has zero say in this.

Also, no one actually check the IDs of my friends, and they don't have to pay the construction company when they first come.

I give the codes, they ring, I open. I hire a company to monitor the building but I can kick then out any day.

I own the place, you see?

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Doesn't really seem like it fits the analogy. Even ignoring that, I doubt they were checking passports and collecting tolls from guests, right?
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Saying that computer/OS manufacturers should prevent malware is effectively equivalent to saying that they should not sell general purpose computers to the public. A general purpose computer is one that can run any program the users tells it to, which necessarily includes one that's malicious.

That doesn't necessarily preclude helping the user to notice when they're doing something dangerous, but a waiting period before the computer becomes general-purpose seems pretty extreme.

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Pretty much everyone would hate it if a relative lost their life savings to a scammer, though they may not know it yet.

The idea isn't to protect the power users or average users. It's to protect the most vulnerable. Android is for everyone. Us power users will have a minor speed bump, but we can deal.

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I would buy this argument if the Play Store wasn't already full of garbage and viruses and scams.
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Android is for everyone, provided they submit to Google exclusively. It's not about power users, and that isn't a speed bump. You can protect vulnerable users without centralizing power like they did, but that's not their motivation so here we are.
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How very noble of Google /s
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