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My guess would be this is less driven by product philosophy, more driven by trying to maximise chances of a return on a very large amount of funding in an incredibly tough market up against formidable, absurdly well-funded competitors.

It's a very tough spot they're in. They have a great product in the code-first philosophy, but it may turn out it's too small a market where the margins will just be competed away to zero by open source, leaving only opportunity for the first-party model companies essentially.

They've obviously had a go at being a first-party model company to address this, but that didn't work.

I think the next best chance they see is going in the vibe-first direction and trying to claim a segment of that market, which they're obviously betting could be significantly bigger. It's faster changing and (a bit) newer and so the scope of opportunity is more unknown. There's maybe more chances to carve out success there, though honestly I think the likeliest outcome is it just ends up the same way.

Since the beginning people have been saying that Cursor only had a certain window of time to capitalise on. While everyone was scrambling to figure out how to build tools to take advantage of AI in coding, they were one of the fastest and best and made a superb product that has been hugely influential. But this might be what it looks like to see that window starting to close for them.

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> It's a very tough spot they're in.

It's a very tough spot they put themselves into. If the goal wasn't to get filthy rich quick it would probably be possible to make a good product without that tough spot.

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You know, it’s stuff like this making me think maybe the anti capitalists have a point.

A company makes a popular product customers like, but to satisfy the VCs the company must make a product the customers don’t like but could make the VCs more money.

Not sure this is the “invisible hand” Adam Smith had in mind.

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In order to make more money you have to make a product customers want.
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According to the comment I replied to you have to make the product VCs think will make VCs the most money, even if that’s at odds with what your customers are telling you they want.
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Anti-capitalist here: Our point is actually the same point as the one Anti-feudalists had. The consumer hostility observed under capitalism is simply a corollary.
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It is interesting that i find composer to be one of my favorites as while it is a bit dumb it is about 100x faster than the fat boys.

Sometimes u need the beef of opus but 80% composer is plenty.

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I have been on the fence if I think composer is useful, but the speed argument is one I hadn’t really considered. I use cursor with Opus almost exclusively but the other day I tried using OpenCode locally with a 6-bit quantized version of Qwen 3.5 and holy crap the speed and latency were mind blowing. Even if not quite as sharp as big boi Opus and the gang.

Now you’ve got me thinking I should give composer another go because speed can be pretty darn great for more generic, basic, tasks.

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> They've obviously had a go at being a first-party model company to address this, but that didn't work.

I thought there was an entire initiative to build their own coding model and the fine tunes of in Composer 1.5 and Composer 2 were just buying them time and training data

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The cancer: growth at every cost or die.

God forbids you make a great product in a specific niche and are happy with the money flowing.

Nope, has to be more.

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Yeah, this model where you don't get an editor anymore feels like a step backwards. I don't want to give up LSPs, being able to step into/rename functions and stuff like that. I should still be the one in control of the code - the agent is the assistant, not me.

This is why Zed's direction felt pretty strong to me. Unfortunately their agentic features are kind of stagnating and the ACP extensions are riddled with issues.

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I actually run a custom fork of Zed based on their master branch because of how stagnated the built-in agent is. Master branch Zed agent did get sub-agents, parallel threads, better thread management, and worktrees though, and I implemented agent skills and the ability to select which model to use for sub-agents for it. And with those features, I'm fairly satisfied.
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It’s very unfortunate what direction Zed has taken. It was very fast and nice editor, that’s now infected with those “AI” features.
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It's still a very nice and fast editor, and you can just switch off those AI features. They're still releasing features and fixes for the non-AI parts.
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did you watch the 90 second video in the post? all of this is addressed
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No but I have now. It’s hard to tell from that few seconds but it doesn’t look like it’s really putting the developer in the driving seat, just providing a minimal escape hatch for manual edits.
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Agreed completely on this (as a heavy daily user of Cursor). It's been the perfect in-between of coding by hand (never again!) and strictly "vibe coding" for me. Being able to keep my eyes on all the changes in a "traditional" IDE view helps me maintain a mental model of how my systems work.

I'm hoping in this new UI in v3 I can still get that experience (maybe it's just hidden behind a toggle somewhere for power users / not shown off in the marketing materials).

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I'm an engineer at Cursor, can try to clarify questions here.

> I wish they'd keep the old philosophy of letting the developer drive and the agent assist. Even when I'm using AI agents to write code, I still find myself spending most of my time reading and reasoning about code.

We very much still believe this, which is why even in this new interface, you can still view/edit files, do remote SSH, go to definition and use LSPs, etc. It's hard to drive and ship real changes without those things in our opinion, even as agents continue to get better at writing code.

> I'm hoping in this new UI in v3 I can still get that experience (maybe it's just hidden behind a toggle somewhere for power users / not shown off in the marketing materials).

This new interface is a separate window, so if you prefer the Cursor 2 style, that continues to exist (and is also getting better).

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Once I downloaded it, it made sense. The blog post almost made me cancel my subscription because it seemed to get rid of the IDE entirely.
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Great, glad to hear that! Stoked to kick the tires on Cursor 3. Thanks for confirming, leerob!
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> We very much still believe this

That's good to hear, I might have jumped a little too quickly in my opinion. It's a bit of a Pavlovian response at this point seeing a product I very much love embrace a giant chat window as a UX redesign haha.

I would love to see more features on the roadmap that are more aligned with users like us that really embrace the Cursor 2 style with the code itself being the focal point. I'm sure there's a lot you can do there to help preserve code mental models when working with agents that don't hide the code behind a chat interface.

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> It's been the perfect in-between of coding by hand (never again!) and strictly "vibe coding" for me.

I dont think there is an inbetween. Its really hard to 'keep an eye' on code by casually reading diffs. Eventually it will become vibe coding.

Software engineers are deluding themselves with spec driven, plans, prds whatever nonsense and thinking its not vibecoding.

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Why?

Reading diffs is an inescapable skill, needed for evaluating any kind of PR. This just makes it more interactive.

I just use Copilot with VS Code, but my flow is to just ask Claude to make a change across whatever files it needs to touch, then either accept the changes, edit the changes directly, or clarify whatever was different from my expectations.

Reading diffs is central to how I work with these agents.

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As a Cursor user who hasn't tried Claude Code yet, am I missing anything? I seem (sometimes) exceptionally productive in it and it's working for me. To my understanding, Claude Code is all terminal, but something like an IDE seems like the better interface to me: I want to see the file system, etc. It seems Cursor doesn't have the mindshare relative to Claude in public discussion spaces.
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Claude Code is where you move up one abstraction layer. Almost everyone using it productively has spend a lot of time working on their harness, ensuring that everything is planned out and structured such that all that is left is really type in the code. This typically works without error. Before that, you interact a lot via Claude Code in whatever abstraction you feel is right.

That's basically it. You can review changes afterwards, but that's not the main point of Claude Code. It's a different workflow. It's built on the premise: given a tight and verifiable plan, AI will execute the actual coding correctly. This will work, mostly, if you use the very best models with a very good and very specific harness.

Cursor, same as Copilot, has been used by people who are basically pair programming with the AI. So, on abstraction down.

I have no idea what is better, or faster. I suspect it depends at least on the problem, the AI, and the person.

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> Cursor, same as Copilot, has been used by people who are basically pair programming with the AI. So, on abstraction down.

This is not really true anymore.

Cursor has better cloud agents than Claude. The multi-agent experience is better, the worktree management is better. Tagging specific code or files in chat is better.

It's hard for me to express the level of pain and frustration I feel going from Cursor to Claude / Conductor+Claude / Claude Extension for VS Code, Claude in Zed, etc.

Really hoping Claude puts more energy into Cowork as a competitor for Cursor and Codex.

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I think you are still speaking in the lower abstraction in terms of zwaps' provided understanding. "Tagging specific code" or "files" is likely the type of interfacing most Claude Code users are _not_ doing.

Instead they are defining architecture through specs and verification-loops and attempting to one-shot solutions fitting clear tests. On reflection, I personally don't have many prompts with CC referencing files or code directly, rather I speak in specifications I can then track to a given instance of work in review.

This isn't to suggest you can't work at this abstraction in cursor or w/e interface, but the features you suggest are hardly relevant to the divide zwaps is identifying.

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I feel like perhaps you haven't used Cursor. I use both CC and Cursor extensively and as far as I can tell there is nothing that the CC agent will do that Cursor won't do just as well (often using Opus as the backend) and at the same time I get the advantage of seeing the changes in a full IDE if I want to. Their new agent-forward UI hides the code if you don't want to see it as much, but I and many others think that it giving me a full, colourful graphical editor to view changes in is a huge advantage.

I'm not telling you to go use cursor, just to help clarify that you can drive both solutions with the exact same approach and skillset and get very similar results - the difference is the UI. I personally like being able to paste screenshots into the agent, etc.

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So that sounds like Claude Code is an inferior subset of Cursor. That Cursor can work like Claude Code, but Claude Code is lacking Cursor’s editing capabilities.
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It's good to try Claude Code just so you focus on skills, agents, and CLAUDE.md

Then when you go back to Cursor it will still support all of those things in the settings.

Using Cursor you tend to not think about those as much since Cursor does a lot of it for you as part of the IDE integration. But it's good to refine it your own way.

But for the most part there isn't much difference.

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Claude Code isn't really "all terminal" if you embed that terminal in your IDE. I still use Cursor (for now), but I embed a CC panel via extension. With this launch of Cursor 3, I'll probably get off Cursor for good. I have zero interest in this.
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Curious, why cursor for this? VSCode or pretty much pure open source IDE's have CC integration. Or am i missing something?
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You don't have to stop using the IDE just because you are using Claude Code. Using both at the same time is best of both worlds in my experience.
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As someone whose work enforced a switch from Cursor to Claude Code, I do keep on top of the code by pairing it with an IDE, tracking/viewing changes etc. There's no real obstacle to using an IDE as you normally would, with Claude Code as a sidecar.
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I run Claude Code from Zed. Very nice experience.
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I tried that for a couple weeks and it's no where near as well integrated as Cursor. I hope they get there though because I like Zed.

Zed plus Claude feels more like using isolated browser extensions instead of something part of the browser (unless you pay for Zeds AI thing then the integration is marginally better).

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> I still want to _code_ not just vibe my way through tickets.

Now we have 3 ways of coding:

* vim / emacs - full manual

* VSCode / IntelliJ - semi-automatic

* ClaudeCode/Codex/OpenCode/... - fully automated

Cursor can't stay in between

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Cursor CLI exist - https://cursor.com/cli
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This is how use cursor 99% of the time. The other 1% is in zed.
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Why?

Are you saying they can’t compete with VS Code in the semi-automatic space?

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There are some critical parts of architecture where sometimes I really do need to see the code and even sometimes put a wall around it and tell the agent they can't touch it.
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Saying it can't stay in between is like saying a company can't sell both regular bikes and electric bikes. Or bikes that can do both.
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embrace tradition, return to vscode
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How would they make money from the tokens then haha? The main revenue driver of these companies is to get people to use more tokens. That’s what they will optimise for. Getting the developers out of the way is the way to do it.
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Isn’t Cursor’s business model mostly subscriptions? They’re the ones paying for inference, not the user directly, right? So wouldn’t they be incentivized to minimize token usage per unit of user value, not maximize raw tokens?
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It's pay-as-you-go after a certain number of included requests/tokens: https://cursor.com/docs/models-and-pricing
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Nope. Enterprise you pay for seat to access all of the enterprise features and then you just pay for tokens as you go. Vast majority of their actual revenue comes from enterprise and their revenue is just api pass through to the model providers.
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Does Cursor make money from tokens?

I thought it was primarily a user of Anthropic and OpenAI APIs, so the fewer tokens you use to accomplish a task, the higher their margin.

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Gemini is featured just as prominently, and they've most recently been pushing their own model series (Composer).
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AI labs think they’re building an autonomous replacement for software engineers, while software engineers see these systems as tools to supplement the process of software engineering.
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Yeah that's the disconnect though right? Even with the best frontier models, you need to do a lot of system design work, planning, and reviewing before you can let these models run.

These models are infinitely more effective when piloted by a seasoned software engineer and that will always be the case so long as these models require some level of prompting to function.

Better prompts come from more knowledgeable users, and I don't think we can just make a better model to change that.

The idea we're going to completely replace software engineers with agents has always been delusional, so anchoring their roadmap to that future just seems silly from a product design perspective.

It's just frustrating Cursor had a good attitude towards AI coding agents then is seemingly abandoning that for what's likely a play to appease investors who are drunk on AI psychosis.

Edit: This comment might have come off more callous than I intended. I just really love Cursor as a product and don't want to see it get eaten by the "AI is going to replace everything!" crowd.

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AI labs won't replace all of the engineers, while engineers becoming more productive, leads to smaller team sizes.
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> AI labs think they’re building an autonomous replacement for software engineers

And management everywhere is convinced that thats what they are paying for. My company is replacing job titles with "builder". Apparently these tools will make builder out of paper pushers hiding in corporate beaurcarcy. I am suddenly same as them now per my company managment.

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I guess they are assuming LLMs will just get better and better until youn don't look at code at all.

Ignoring the fact that software will just keep getting more and more complex and interconnected... There will always be a new frontier or code and UX

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That philosophy wouldnt help justify the narrative for their massive valuation.
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> I feel like this design direction is leaning more towards a chat interface as a first class citizen and the code itself as a secondary concern.

That's because that's exactly where we're headed, and it's fine.

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NASA vibes all its note taking apps
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I just upgraded and you can still show/hide the entire editor like before
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Agent is where tokens are consumed, and where they can charge you more.
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The philosophy still works, you just have to change your view. Instead of trying to work side by side with the agent on every turn (inside of your IDE), instead the agent performs a unit of work and then you review it. You can use your IDE to view the diff, or another diffing tool.

If you've dug in sufficiently on plan mode, then what the agent is executing is not a surprise and shouldn't need input. If it does, the plan was insufficient and/or the context around the request (agents.md, lessons.md, or whatever tools and documents you use ) weren't sufficient.

EDIT: Maybe it doesn't work in cursor, but I continue to use vscode to review diffs and dig in on changes.

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Imagine you are the top engineer of your company. Everybody wants your attention, many meetings, design sessions, and of-course code reviews.

With Claude Code, I use Gitlab for reviewing code. And then I let Claude pull the comments.

It looks like the new UI has a big focus on multiple agents. While it feels wrong, the more you split up your work into smaller merge requests, the easier it is to review the work.

Chat first is the way to go since you want the agent busy making its code better. Let it first make plans, come up with different ideas, then after coding let it make sure it fully tests that it works. I can keep an agent occupied for over a hour with e2e tests, and it’s only a couple hundred lines of code in the end.

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Then code.
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At least these are IDEs with the save button finally gone

We needed that jump, there were still floppy disk icons

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Why I harp on owning your stack instead of outsourcing your Ai experience and interface to Big Ai. There are many frameworks that make this much easier today. I chose ADK which is more of a lift, but also works for non-coding use cases.
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that is what is catching the most users right? they want to vibe code their way into oblivion
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I agree. I am building www.propelcode.app for this exact reason.

I get the temptation of letting agents do everything. But they create really bad systems still (bad architecture, reimplementation of solved problems etc).

I also get the temptation for beginners and think it’s great that more people are empowered to build software but moving entirely to chat means they won’t learn and level up which in the long run limits their ability.

I could be wrong. And my way of thinking is dying but thankfully I can build the tool I want.

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