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I mean, yes, they do. It varies, depending on the specific foraging society, since they're not a monolith.

Hadza men spend enough time with their children that their T levels drop: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2674347/

Aka men let their children suck on their nipples: https://www.theguardian.com/society/2005/jun/15/childrensser...

This is a nice survey of the role of fatherhood in various cultures, with a focus on foragers: https://anthro.vancouver.wsu.edu/media/documents/fa_role_201...

Near the beginning, the paper states that humans are extremely unusual in the rates of paternal investment that fathers do. With most species, the male dips. Men don't always spend a lot of time on children, but they have the wiring for it.

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But for women it's natural? How convenient
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> It’s probably unnatural for adult men to spend much time with tiny children in the first place.

Sorry, what? The framing of this sentence alone has a very creepy vibe. I can't speak for all of us, but most us have strong protective instincts towards kids of all ages, especially the youngest ones.

> This is why many men find it difficult, it is contrary to instinct.

Contrary to whose instinct? If I had a kid, I would want to ensure his/her safety and success. Men in general yearn for it. And there's nothing that suggests men are incapable of it. Research indicates good outcomes. And I know fathers who are the sole care givers for young kids when life makes it inconvenient for the mother.

> Do hunter gatherers split care of tiny children? Whatever they do is what we’re wired for, mostly.

Hunter gatherer culture is at least ten thousand years old - plenty of time for social behavior to evolve. Modern humans, including men are very heavily invested in kids because humans can't have a lot of kids. Ensuring each one's safety becomes important.

Heck! Humans, including males are very nurturing and protective towards even children of other men and other species. Plenty of evidence that your assertion doesn't hold at all.

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But it’s ok for child men to spend time with children? That seems dangerous. Who would teach them about scissors? Furthermore, when does a child stop being a tiny child? And at that point can any adult male of the species interact with them or is there some kind of age to height progression where it becomes safe?

In very much more serious, but perhaps less kind thoughts, do you not get halfway through writing things like that without considering how fundamentally broken that thinking is? My heart seriously goes out to you, unless it’s not ok given I am pretty tall and you might be 12 or something so it may still be a few years before we can talk, but I may be dead by then and it feels like you could use a pal, lil buddy.

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Woah. As an adult man with five kids, two of them infants, the most natural thing in the world is for them to be present in almost every second of my life.

It’s not difficult at all. Minutes after birth, naked baby was on my naked chest, and bonding started. This never felt contrary to my instinct.

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This sounds like bro science.
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As a father I can assure you you have no idea what you're talking about.
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I can't speak for the person you're responding to, but my default reaction to people who say things like this is that they probably don't have kids, and if they do, I wonder about the well-being of their family life. I don't mean that to be insulting at all. It seems completely incompatible with being a family- or community-involved person.

And what's society without kids? Whether you're a parent or not, we need kids to do well. It makes no sense at all not to learn to be good with kids, to care about them, to invest in them, etc. They're firmly a core component of human society, certainly not going anywhere.

And I can't imagine not spending a lot of time with my kids. It's one of the things I think about most. I like to do a lot of things, but they're one of the few things I can always say yes to. I want to take care of them, teach them, learn from them, listen to them, see them grow, whatever. It just feels good to be in their lives. There's nothing unnatural about it.

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> I can't speak for the person you're responding to, but my default reaction to people who say things like this is that they probably don't have kids,...

I don't have kids and it still sounds nonsensical. As a man, my instinct isn't to run away from my child if I had one. If life keeps men and their children apart, that's a different matter altogether. But I have seen other men yearn to be with their little kids. My father did the same when I was young. Some of them are their kids' sole caregiver for the majority of the time because life keeps the mother away from the child. And in all instances, I see strong paternal affection and instincts at play. I'm baffled by an assertion otherwise.

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Echoing this.

The bond I have with my children is profound and primal. The idea that it’s “unnatural” for me to spend much time with them is so ridiculous as to be instantly dismissed.

GP clearly doesn’t have kids or have close male friends who are involved with their kids.

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N = 1. now compare the number of single mothers (≈ children abandoned by their fathers) vs the number of single fathers (≈ children abandoned by their mothers).

for every helicopter dad there are ten guys who don't care about their offspring.

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"Look how many people get shot versus stabbed. Obviously the natural order is for people to get shot."
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