Even if it's hard to conclusively prove intent, I think it's easy to see how there must have been at least recklessness in play and perhaps even wilful blindness.
replyIn other words, even if they didn't know that what they were doing was harmful, they should have.
The distinction between punishment and prevention seems important here. Meta's intent might matter when deciding liability or penalties, but if a design pattern is demonstrably harmful, "we only wanted more engagement" isn't much of an argument against regulating it
replyThere was a moment in time when Instagram use to show this disclaimer "You're all caught up with the posts". You could still scroll below that and it would show you algorithmic content as it always have if you choose to view it. However I don't see this feature anymore and it's gotten worse with pure infinite slop. I really appreciated that cause every time I opened the app, saw that disclaimer I would instantly close it and go about doing other things. I wish they just kept simple stuff like that around but I guess that doesn't help their metrics.
reply>There was a moment in time when Instagram use to show this disclaimer "You're all caught up with the posts".
replyThis still exists and I get it every day. It is the floor for my feed. I have to refresh or close the app and reopen to fetch more.
the engagement argument could be applied to every commercial service or product. anything that is sold is getting optimized for appeal/attraction/engagement/adictiveness.
replyAddicts are your most loyal and exploitable customers.
replyThings will keep getting worse in the US as long as the current nothing is anti-competitive policies endure.
I agree. Our policy going forward needs to be as precise as a scalpel.
replyhave worked in analytics for a while. Engagement is a very broad category. Not all engagement metrics are toxic. For example, daily active users is healthy for a business to measure and is engagement. Commenting on Hackernews is engagement. Meta also has a wide range of engagement metrics - not all of which are problematic
replyI've never seen a NAXALT fallacy used for the concept of engagement metrics before.
replyIt's not relevant to this discussion that in certain contexts, useful engagement metrics exist that supposedly aren't toxic, because it doesnt apply to the current context. We're clearly talking about the larger systemic issue of companies maximizing all engagement at all costs, and the consequences of such a policy.
For anyone else not understanding the reference: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/NAXALT
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