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by doginasuit6 hours ago |
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upvoteby Alifatisk6 hours ago|
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Yes Chinese models censor some historical events. This is nothing knew and well known thing. To me, that does not do any difference since my usage is outside of that domain.

Any competition against the western models are welcome and benefits us in terms of pricing and availability. If they have to comply with CCP to be able to do it, then so be it.

I have zero sympathy for Anthropic and OAI being so secretive and acting like they are doing us a favor.

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upvoteby treesknees2 hours ago|
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In my experience, it’s their chat harnesses/website that filters historical events. The model itself doesn’t.

For example you can point opencode at DeepSeek v4 and ask, it will accurately tell you about Tiananmen square.

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upvoteby tyre4 hours ago|
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What it shows is that the CCP has enough oversight and control (either explicitly or by the companies making these decisions by default) that they will alter the models to benefit China.

Who is to say they aren't doing it in other ways as well? That they aren't, or won't be, subtly hamstrung in engineering work?

OAI and Anthropic have their own issues, you're right to be suspicious of them, but it's not like their models answer with, "capitalism is god's gift to His chosen people" or whatever. Their limits on cybersecurity, biological warfare, etc. at least make some sense in the context of lowering harm—not just protecting a specific government party.

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upvoteby addozhang3 hours ago|
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If you don't want to use the Chinese model, then don't. Why attack it instead? Don't you want others to use it either?
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upvoteby dash231 minutes ago|
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The OP is pointing out issues that he thinks other people ought to consider before using Chinese models.
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upvoteby CuriouslyC3 hours ago|
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Try asking claude questions about biology/LLM recipes. Or GPT about how to do something illegal but only harmful in the abstract (e.g. creative ways to reduce your tax burden, or circumvent digital protections)
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upvoteby janstice5 hours ago|
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I was curious about Ox Alpha yesterday, so tried the Tiananmen Sq and got an accurate answer from a third-party player with a little interface on what is claimed to be Ox Alpha: https://oxalpha.com/chat?q=what+happened+in+Tiananmen+square... (and a more detailed answer today when I asked again).

But nothing (at all) from asking GLM-5.3-Flash directly in the OpenRouter chat interface.

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upvoteby girvo5 hours ago|
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Yeah censoring in modern chinese models is mostly done using inference-time censoring, not training-time. A lot less RLHF. Run the weights yourself and you can see that, though it does depend on which company.

StepFun for example, will happily answer it when running Step 3.7 Flash locally

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upvoteby loehnsberg5 hours ago|
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Deepseek and GLM answered correctly on Openrouter when using non-Chinese endpoints. I hope it stays that way!
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upvoteby sivakon1 hours ago|
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correctly is very loaded here. correct according to whom? the truth is different though.
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