AI output right now is like a final exam essay response from an anxious student. Instead of being edited for focus and clarity, it's anti-edited to cram in as many details as possible. Instead of worrying that the reader might get bored or confused, it assumes that the reader has no choice but to read the whole thing, even if they get a headache. It doesn't care about picking the most useful perspective on a problem; it cares about covering every possible angle that a grader might use to dock points from it.
replyIt's basically the work you get from a smart, diligent person who is oblivious to any shared goal and approaches every assignment with a CYA attitude.
Pretty good analogy. I'd also compare it to a junior employee who tries to make people care about the how of their work rather than the results.
replyit's due to how rewards work during RL no? it needs to try to check off all the boxes to get a max score
replyThat, and Every Sentence Is Punchy.
replyEvery sentence sounds like it's trying to be in the trailer for a film.
You just very nicely explained why I sometimes overcommunicate.... That's exactly how it feels
replyHere's my prompt when I don't know what the hell the AI is saying.
reply"Expand. Clarify for human. 5 minute read max. Senior engineer audience."
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reply"Write short paragraphs with simple words, use bullet lists when appropriate."
reply"Be terse."
replyThanks! I will add this to the tricks. AI is a fuzzy search and a fuzzy function.
replyironically, this would be useful for a prompt on how not to build build a site.
replyThis is a great analogy
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replyBerkshire got it right a long time ago.
replyNah, if this was the OP website you’d be complaining that it tells you nothing and you have no idea what they do or what they are presenting still. Also that it looks like shit on mobile. You’re just glazing the company in this case.
replyYou should go with the canonical HN quality website references: McMaster-Carr, Craigslist
Nothing will ever top gwern.net
replyMcMaster’s paper catalogs were phenomenal, with an organization that quickly surfaced the part you wanted and often taught you taxonomy if you were looking for something unusual to you. A true masterpiece and they clearly carried their philosophy to their web design
replyMcMaster-Carr is unbeaten.
reply> If you have any comments about our WEB page, you can write us at the address shown above. However, due to the limited number of personnel in our corporate office, we are unable to provide a direct response.
replyA profoundly polite way to tell someone to stuff it.
This site proves to me that the better you are at the things that matter most in your niche, the more you can get away with not even trying in other areas.
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replythis is a great example for me to use in meetings. I often see people looking for "good" examples of web design from fortune 500 companies or similar. Gonna use this to throw a wrench in that one soon.
replyThe Geico ad gave me a laugh.
replyThere's a "unsloppify site" toggle on top but the unsloppified version looks exactly as vibe coded as the regular one.
replyYeah, I'm not sure which way is supposed to be "sloppified". The default looks stylistically less slop-like, but obviously has the same filler content issue.
replyThe blue one is the VibeTemplate_03. I see it everywhere.
replyThe yellow one is at just a ripoff of an early 00s edgy news site. It could very well also be a VibeTemplate, but I've not seen a tool generate a site that looks like that by default.
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replyI love how the 'unsloppify' button changes the theme but nothing else, and also messes with the layout enough that you can't actually toggle it without scrolling and repositioning your cursor.
replyI had to re-read a few times to figure out what the site was for and about. Still not sure I understand but that's the problem for them. If I'm a customer, I'm gone cause I can't figure out what it's for and I see this far too often nowadays for a lot of technical sites.
replyI already closed it after two pageful of not explaining what this thing is.
replyGlad to know its not just me. I also don't get it.
reply> These one shot vibecoded sites are always a complete visual headache.
replySure, but have you seen the Typesafe.ai site itself? I think this is meant as a homage.
I'm soon going back to pure html, jesus christ
replyThere is an "Unsloppify site" button which makes it a bit better.
replyI.. kind of like it? Aware that it isn't great and that I'm in the minority.
replyIt's nice to see some variation in websites. Makes each one feel so special.
replyGonna need these people to at least prefix their prompts with "You are Edward Tufte and have an allergy to chartjunk".
replyWhat’s really hilarious is that there’s an “un-slop site” button that does absolutely nothing to un-sloppify the site
replyIt improves the text readability quite a bit, at least for me, but the soullessness is still there.
replyI'm not sure which version is the "unsloppified" one, perhaps it's derived from https://github.com/AlexSchmalex97/The-Nothing-Button
replyThe unslopify toggle is pretty funny though lol
replyAnd yet, it makes the front page of HN. The bar is low.
replyThe irony here being:
reply- the "vibecoded site" was not vibecoded.
- when you turn "vibecoded off" on this vibecoded site, you get standard Claude slop
Nasty little site, between that and pretending LLMs are the same as Jev.
I see you've edited your comment to remove the part about the vibecoded website being disrespectful towards humans. As a human I find these types of comments about the vibecoded websites, when the submission is not about the website, disrespectful.
replyDo you have anything to say about OpenJev, which is not about the website?
Yes. These jev-copy projects are all vibecoded, and only mimic the shape of output. Typesafe's documentation is excellent and provides developers with guidance on what exactly to expect from their model. It's also clear that typesafe developed a generalist model that they've tested to work across domains and use cases.
replyUsing libraries like this provide none of those assurances. Sure, you can improve performance with fine tuning , but then we're going back to doing what a model like jev was created to eliminate.
Is this clear? The model has a waitlist and isn't publicly available. How can you claim it's proficient at general tasks?
replyIt's generally available on OpenRouter now: https://openrouter.ai/~typesafe/jev-latest
replyTouche. I'm using it and find their claims credible but they deserve broader scrutiny.
reply> These jev-copy projects are all vibecoded
replySince you've looked at all of them, why do you think https://huggingface.co/convaiinnovations/laya is vibecoded?
This is a link to a fine tuned modernbert model. Like I said, a bert model can produce jev shaped objects but they're too small to generalize.
replyI asked about it being vibecoded since you claimed that all jev-like projects are vibecoded. You responded to something I didn't ask.
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