>However, Anthropic’s disclosure to KBRA excluded several important financial metrics, including free cash flow and earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation and amortisation. Credit rating analysts had to come up with their own estimates based on assumptions, the documents show.
>Given the limited information, KBRA produced a “risk score” to assess Anthropic’s creditworthiness rather than the traditional full financial models.
This and the fact they went to a small ratings agency does not inspire confidence in the rating.
Why didn’t they give them the info? They either withheld it or don’t have it. Both make them look bad.
that's a bigger red flag. there may be reasons (bad) to not give them all the info, but going to a smaller agency is the largest of red flags when you are that big of a company.
...and score still showed "high probability of being junk"?
All ratings agencies have their own scales, but broadly all ratings fall into one of two overarching categories, investment grade vs. junk.
The article explains that the rating ANT received was the highest within the junk range. So “highest junk rating” means within the junk category, it’s in the best sub-area. In other words, it’s just scratching below the investment grade rating.
This is important for institutional investors who can only buy investment grade, meaning if they can improve even one single grade up, they get access to a lot more debt.
"The rating action, which has not previously been reported, shows Anthropic is close to achieving the investment-grade status that would allow the start-up to lower its borrowing costs and tap a wider pool of institutional investors including life insurance companies and pension funds.
Bankers for Anthropic and rival OpenAI have lobbied the largest rating agencies to grant the AI labs investment-grade ratings once they go public."
"The rating action, which has not previously been reported, shows Anthropic is close to achieving the investment-grade status that would allow the start-up to lower its borrowing costs and tap a wider pool of institutional investors including life insurance companies and pension funds.
Bankers for Anthropic and rival OpenAI have lobbied the largest rating agencies to grant the AI labs investment-grade ratings once they go public."
Okay thanks
As in "main ratings agencies" see no reason to bother
I’d reserve judgement until i see them report more detailed financials and the big ratings agencies step in with assessment.
Like if there is a significant risk of bankruptcy then there must on the other side of the scale be a possibility of making bank like you have with stock or derivatives.
Credit worthiness of each mortgage wasn't the issue with mortgage-backed securities. It was that low value mortgage-backed securities were repackaged into a basket with a mix of securities and given a higher credit rating than what Subprime would have gotten on their own.
This repackaging is absolutely going to happen again with GPUs. If there are GPUs of different generations within the same security, it's already happened.
The problem is OAI/Anthropic - but if OAI and Anthropic fail the whole thing comes apart. Goog, Meta etc will be fine as they had tremendous cash flow generating operations prior to datacenter offerings w.r.t LLMs.
Let’s be clear about what this means: it gives them access to the corporate bond market. What they’re lobbying for is that pension funds, life insurance, etc., can take exposure to these companies. Suddenly the everyman, your mom and dad, have significant exposure to these companies and their circular financing deals without even knowing it. This is disgusting.
What a lot of people fail to realize is that the rules around IPOs changed since the dot com bubble. Previously, employees counted as shareholders and companies above a certain threshold of shareholders were required to IPO. This is why companies like Microsoft, Amazon, etc., had the majority of their growth while being publicly traded. This allowed the everyman with a brokerage account to participate in these gains.
These rules were essentially removed by Obama in 2012 through the JOBS act. What this means is that companies can stay private for a majority of their growth phase, which is why we’re seeing IPOs being floated with $2T dollar amounts on them. They’ve privatized the gains, and they only IPO once they want to cash out.
So let’s understand clearly what’s about to happen: early VC investors in oai/ant are going to make billions selling dogshit to your parents pension funds, your parents pension funds are run by idiots who will gleefully take the AI exposure and are legally allowed to take that AI exposure because the AI companies lobbied the credit rating agencies to allow it, and when the bills come next year and these companies are completely unable to meet their liabilities, your parents have to postpone their retirements or come back out of retirement to make ends meet.
It’s truly evil. I hope the employees at these companies with dollar signs in their eyes awaiting their multimillion dollar payoff understand the system that they’re participating in and how evil it is.
Point blank: 2008 was about manipulation of the credit rating agencies. This bubble will also be about manipulation of the credit rating agencies. Absolutely deplorable.
And no, just to nip this in the bud, AI isn’t a fad. It’s the most transformative technology of our lifetimes. It’s going to change everything. But that doesn’t have anything to do with chaos in financial markets or malinvestment during the gold rush. It has to do with whether these companies have any kind of moat and whether the billions being poured into current generation chips are going to depreciate over the timeframes that investors think they will.
First you say you don't like that they're accessing the corporate bond market, which is something all public companies can do.
Then you say they should've IPO'd earlier when they were even earlier stage and riskier .. which would allow them to issue bonds even earlier?
What is your position? Or are you complaining for the sake of complaining?
What I really want above all else is for credit rating agencies to not face pressure to rerate them favorably because they’re deemed too big to fail.
They can lobby all they want but until we see ratings agencies bending to their lobbying in the face of extreme scrutiny from anyone who would buy these corporate bonds I wouldn't go about worrying too much.
And if default risk rises, yes the value of those bonds will get crushed. But Id argue the value of equity will be more so - since they are not A) positive EBIT B) EBITDA
Those two numbers are variables that compose measures of default risk.
Calm your panties down. Kroll != S&P.
What's the problem? Fund managers—who are in a position to understand the risks more than your everyday investor—can decide if they want buy these bonds or not, just like any other public corporate bond.
2008 wasn't fund managers deciding all together in unison to buy bad mortgages. It was AAA ratings on diversified MBS that should have been rated much lower giving them cover to load up.
[1] https://www.wsj.com/livecoverage/stock-market-today-dow-sp-5...
[2] https://www.tradingview.com/news/seekingalpha:173ffc32a094b:...
[3] https://www.cnbc.com/2026/10/15/coreweave-credit-default-swa...
You can't really rip off bond-holders when you are not positive EBIT and EBITDA...
BB+ is technically junk. But the it is one notch from investment grade. Also Junk ratings are normal for young. So the framing is sensationalized.
"Growth has slowed" is technically true but misleading. Q2 to Q3 still went from $11.5bn to $16.8bn. And at those levels, it’s not wildly unexpected that it has to slow down.
And the bias is obvious when they write "Despite limited disclosures" which makes it sounds suspicious, when it’s normal thatrivate companies don't publish financials.
It’s also technical errors. Broadcom agreed to support the residual value of the chips, they did not guarantee the loan.
When journalists and news organizations are this terrible at basic reporting, Within their own specialized domain, it's hard to find sympathy for their complaints about AI-generated content taking over.
Edit: after another look I found that the agency that gave the rating also is a new small one with not very good record eighter (Kroll Bond Rating Agency).
Alternative title: Small Agency, which is previously has been fined for Ratings Without Method, Guesses that Anthropic's Numbers are close to normal for startups; FT Reports the Guess as News.
The growth slowdown is decidedly unexpected. The market priced in a $2T valuation that assumed it wouldn’t slow down.
https://www.reuters.com/business/finance/investors-temper-an...