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by YakGuano5 hours ago |
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upvoteby bwanab5 hours ago|
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As Hannah Ritchie (Our World In Data) has pointed out, even with the worst coal powerplant powering the grid, an EV is getting a much better CO2 per mile driven than an ICE. As the grid powerplants improve, that only gets better. An ICE car is always an ICE.
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upvoteby blacksmith_tb5 hours ago|
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Of course, if you look at the energy mix for our grid. But the possibility (maybe even the inevitability) exists that the grid will be powered by cleaner sources over time. No such possibility exists for an ICE vehicle...

I generate 80% of the power I drive on (PHEV + 10kW of PV on the roof), though I mostly commute by bike so I don't drive a ton.

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upvoteby tootie5 hours ago|
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Grid electricity generation is more efficient than ICE. Fossil fuel extraction is a major emitter even before the fuel is burned. Decarbonising the grid is underway.
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upvoteby Atreiden5 hours ago|
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True, but that's not a limitation of EVs but rather the state of energy production in most countries. An economy that moves towards solar/nuclear/wind will see blanket decreases in emissions across the entire fleet of EVs it supports.

Not to mention that even in the current state of affairs in the US, the emissions are far lower on average. Even in states where production is 60% coal: http://large.stanford.edu/courses/2023/ph240/stafford1/

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upvoteby moate5 hours ago|
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The word is "less", not "no" and I think that's the magical thinking OP was trying to address. Electric cars create LESS emissions, not none.
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upvoteby thinkybrewster5 hours ago|
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Unless they're charged by wind or solar, in which case no, during their operation, nothing is emitted into the atmosphere.
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upvoteby Atreiden5 hours ago|
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It's not really magical thinking; if the grid moves to solar/nuclear/wind then there are virtually no emissions here.

Yes, we're not there yet, and that's why I prefaced with "True", but I think this kind of splitting hairs is part of the problem. EVs are vastly better for the environment and have no emissions of their own. Yes emissions do come from somewhere in the current state, but path to a cleaner environment is not radically far away and the thesis that "emissions come from somewhere so that's not a reason to buy an EV" is ludicrous at best and disingenuous at worst.

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upvoteby thinkybrewster5 hours ago|
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A glorious double example of Simpson's paradox.

Naively you might think this (eg here in Australia the majority of electricity is still generated by burning coal) but:

- this is not true during certain times of day, and,

- this is not true for a growing number of buildings that have PV solar

Wait till you learn when, and how, the typical Australian EV gets charged!

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