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> But they are not doing enough to protect children from predators

My understanding is that the recent improvements are face scans, and communication limited to people within a few 4 year windows.

They've also increased moderation of chat significantly, especially for the lower age windows.

What low hanging fruit do you see? What's the "ideal" system? Seems like a hard problem, if any sort of cooperative communication/play is involved.

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It is indeed a hard provlem. No low hanging fruit. There certainly not alone, but have a bigger issue with grooming and predation since half of all kids use their platform.

It would be an easy problem if the government put in place sensible reforms for age verification.

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> It would be an easy problem if the government put in place sensible reforms for age verification.

Implying there's a simple solution that isn't being implemented because they weren't forced to by law. So what is that simple solution?

Children typically don't have any form of government issued ID. You can verify someone is a legal adult (you probably shouldn't, but the point is that you can) whereas you can't easily verify that someone online is a child.

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> It would be an easy problem if the government put in place sensible reforms for age verification.

What would these reforms look like?

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I thought that sounded off, Wikipedia says it's half of all American kids.
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It’s certainly more than half of all my kids.Also more than half of the kids I know in Japan.
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I realize people may find this controversial, but from personal experience with gaming, I see all of these types of games as “predators” in and of themselves when they are “monetized”, because they are deliberately and explicitly exploiting the addicting nature of games in general, by being and manipulating a freebase of dopamine and serotonin just like the gambling industry does/used to.

If we survive this era with an intact advanced civilization, I believe people will look back on this period and “games” as an insane thing to permit, let alone facilitate and perpetrate upon one’s own children, the next generation, the offspring necessary for survival of a life form, species, race, society, or culture.

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The ideal system as far as I'm concerned is one that regulates Roblox out of existence for a variety of sins.

At this point I'm just waiting for someone to dig up a name associated with Roblox in the Epstein files, because that's the only way I can conceive of how they've managed to avoid getting shut down this long.

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Please don't make excuses for literal evil p*dophile megacorporations. There is plenty of low hanging fruit, and even if there wasn't, this issue is important enough that if they can't fix it they should go out of business.

1. They can just disable chat for non age verified accounts. Done. Problem fixed. Oh, but they'll lose money, won't they? That takes precedence over child safety.

2. The community is willing to help. You can find examples of independent actors uncovering tens of thousands of NSFW communities and accounts and submitting them to Roblox with detailed descriptions of the activities of each one, only for Roblox to perma-ban AND SUE the people doing the investigations, and not ban the offending accounts.

3. They can build an actual strong safety team. A $40B company can afford to throw a few million dollars per year to hire 200 people to do that same investigatory work. This is typical tech firm behavior, where they believe every problem can be automated away, and they're not willing to do the minimal amount of manual labor.

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See this is why I think the whole age verification thing is backwards. If you want to create child friendly spaces then you need to verify someone's age is under 18, 16, 13 etc.. That's a way more real and tangible harm than a teenager looking at a nudie mag.
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Please check this box to confirm that you do _not_ possess a government issued photo ID ...

Sorry, in order to use this service you will need to visit your local police station and have them verify that you are in fact a child ...

Yeah I'm not seeing how this is supposed to work. I don't think age verification solves very many real world problems. (It does mitigate some, such as alcohol consumption. Just not most.)

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>Yeah I'm not seeing how this is supposed to work

You could verify the ID of an adult who vouches for the child they are a legal guardian of. That way, if it turns out that Brayden(M12) is actually Linda(F45) you know who to send law enforcement to to ask some very pointed questions.

That said, I don't think online ID verification is effective and even if it was, it wouldn't be worth the level of mass privacy invasion. If your goal is actually to help kids who are victims of abuse, your efforts are much better spent elsewhere. For example: making child abuse report hotlines/websites more easily accessible and widely known, fixing social services so that they actually provide better help when requested instead of making things worse, better education for children about what is and is not OK behavior even from "trusted" adults, and how to get help from someone who isn't a relative when you need it. "Stranger danger" hysteria catches all the outrage and public discussion, but is the least common source of abuse.

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Enforce parental control (with a verified adult account for the parent) for all child accounts.

The parent will input the real birthdate of their child, or it's their responsibility if the child encounters anything not age appropriate.

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For sure. But age verification protocols can handle such rules:

App to IdP: is this person 13-15

IdP: yes

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Is Persona an IdP or does it request you to verify with personal information every single time?
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It sounds like, from this thread, that it's Roblox themselves who are the predators.
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> But they are not doing enough to protect children from predators and that's a huge legal and regulatory risk.

I run a studio that makes Roblox experiences and this is Discord's problem, and will immediately become Telegram's problem the decade where parents and policy makers figure out its Discord's problem

their kid went into an experience within Roblox so I can see that's the branding, the parent paid the kid's allowance in Robux, so I can again see that's the branding

but this is largely a symptom of parents nationwide not paying attention whatsoever

I've talked to many parents, aunts and uncles, they don't know they're the central bank of Roblox of a currency that can be accumulated and cashed out, let alone that its a distributed set of third party experiences.

Roblox Corporation already has age gated talking ability on platform. What specifically should they be doing when everything happens in different communities and off platform?

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Interesting. If you don't mind me asking. If I understand the business correctly, the brands are inquiring to design specialized worlds in Roblox so kids can play in them and look at ads?
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that's not my business, the economy is pretty vast with several key verticals

the experiences I'm involved with just have their own things to purchase as part of the game loop. it's much more akin to a vending machine.

never involved with any brand, at least that wasn't roblox native, and by roblox native I mean influencers that may as well be a brand of their own.

if you followed the "metaverse" concept from earlier in the decade, there was Meta's attempt, there were crypto and NFT based attempts, although that's all said to have died, the metaverse is happening within Roblox. the point if that if you had a grasp of what the metaverse was supposed to be, you can use that understanding to understand what Roblox is

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This is the actual excuse Roblox used when confronted with actual evidence of child sex trafficking originating on their platform, at the same time balking at implementing age gates and chat restrictions. So of course they caved and implemented age gates and chat restrictions when their "central bank" (a.k.a. concerned parents) learned about Roblox's "issues" from YouTube exposés and other concerned parents.

It doesn't matter that the illegal shit happens off-platform. It is not a good look to be the top of the funnel for traffickers, which is why they put in these invasive restrictions.

If you don't like it, then invest in "creating experiences" for platforms which don't target children. Because asking "what is Roblox supposed to do about their pedo problem" didn't and will never work to placate the people who actually fund the platform.

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This doesn’t really make sense though. If half of all American children are on your platform of course that’s a prime target. That’s a volume issue, not something inherent to the platform.

I’m going to guess those numbers are still far lower than the number of times kids get messed up by a trusted adult.

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Parents haven't changed their behavior and the age gating is there now and the activity on Discord is still the problem

Not an excuse, not pointing fingers, as a betting man thats the actual answer and any other bet would go to zero, its what happening

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I hate it. What a waste of a perfectly good generation.
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The generation that's going to enter adulthood in the age of unchecked climate change and AI taking over their careers?

I say let them enjoy themselves while they still can.

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The generation that's going to enter adulthood in the age of unchecked climate change and AI taking over their careers?

You forgot the part where they also became addicts to games that only exist to funnel money to tech feudalist overlords.

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> But they are not doing enough to protect children from predators and that's a huge legal and regulatory risk.

It's first and foremost a huge risk for kids.

My solution is simple: my daughter (11 y/o) can play Roblox but she must be in a game with another friend (whom I know and whom I know her parents) and she must on a video/conf-call with that friend, using another device, while she plays Roblox. That way I hear everything they're saying.

And they're ecstatic and having lots of fun.

I check the chat once in a while: the rule is "not hiding the chat when parents look or no more Roblox".

Keeps her mostly at bay from predators.

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I feel like for a 11yo, you can't even explain the risks. Not just for lack of true comprehension, but also just kids shouldn't have to worry about that stuff, and just be kids.
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Wut? If they’re using the internet they should be aware of that stuff. That’s what ‘just be kids’ means these days. Just being a kid isn’t a static state of being.
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It's no longer safe for children to be unsupervised on the internet.
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So then they shouldn’t use the internet. I’m not going to fill my kids mind with all the dangers in the world when all they should be thinking about when they’re 8 is academics, friends and personal pursuits and achievements.
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My son has had the local police do a presentation to his class/preschool/daycares about online safety every year since he was 4 so it's pretty drilled in by this point.
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Getting them to accept the normalisation of surveillance while they're young?

And then people wonder why authoritarianism is on the rise...

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Getting watched by your parents is far different than getting watched by the government. It's no different than parent watching out of the window on kids playing in backyard

> And then people wonder why authoritarianism is on the rise...

It's on the rise because of utter failure of progressive govt to do what people want them to do. People want country to be more prosperous, not to have bleeding heart activists import immigrants or other leftist bullshit. Authoritarian turn is knee jerk reaction to that beacuse they are only ones promising the country for the citizens of the country. If you want less of that, make left that cares about country's people

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Getting watched by your parents is far different than getting watched by the government. It's no different than parent watching out of the window on kids playing in backyard

Maybe it's a cultural difference, but after age ~8-9 or so, we would just roam around our town/village without our parents knowing where we were. You just had to be back home at 17:30 for dinner.

Yes, there was some mischief (we were kids), but you had to own up to it if you got caught and there weren't smartphone cameras around everywhere, so if you did something dumb, it would not be on the internet the next day.

The problem with modern games and social media is that they are like giving crack to a 10 year-old. They are made for dopamine hits that leads to addiction. Kid's brains are not fully developed until well after 18, so they have limited capability to recognize and deal with addiction.

People want country to be more prosperous, not to have bleeding heart activists import immigrants or other leftist bullshit. Authoritarian turn is knee jerk reaction to that beacuse they are only ones promising the country for the citizens of the country.

Oh my...

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Still, at some point you do have to give some privacy to your kids. I know the trend is helicopter parenting but it's not helping the kid to be overprotecting.
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This is ridiculous. She 11, take the damn tablet away from her.
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