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This is a real problem, but when I complain about it I get told to just "hide the icons you don't care about" as if that's a solution.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47346079

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I struggled with disappearing icons (like our company VPN client - which wasn't tailscale by the way) thinking the app was somehow "stuck". I would go kill the app, restart machine etc - during restart it would get fixed "automatically" by being an app earlier in the order!

Took me months to figure out it was running afterall and just hidden by the notch.

How hard is for apple to move the "least used icons" to a fold? (but still accessible)

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Especially bad for people with poor eyesight who have to use the display scaling set toward "Large Text" instead of "Default" or "More Space"

Between the larger display scaling, losing space to the notch, and the IT department setting up new computers with 8 little pieces of preinstalled bullshit up there, Apple's perspective on this seems to be "if the Ivanti VPN menu extra disappears I guess you didn't really need that anyway!"

Having the sound, bluetooth, wifi, and other system stuff removed from the bar and accessible in control center helps, but is not sufficient.

They're too busy solving important problems like "how can I use part of my screen as a videoconferencing light source" and chasing yearly iOS new feature parity to deal with pesky things like menu extras. It's only been 25 years since OS X came out.

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Poor eyesight? How about just being over 45?

My visual acuity at distance has not changed from when I was 20. My ability to read tiny, poorly-contrasted text at phone distance has.

Enlarging text size is a massive benefit to everyone as we age. It’s one of the reasons that older readers were among the first to adopt e-ink readers and tablets: every book suddenly becomes a large-print book. In the world of accessibility this is one of the easiest things to do with one of the largest impacts. Not everyone is blind, not everyone is hard of hearing, but everyone gets presbyopia if they live long enough.

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Yep, and there's no indication that anything is hidden, no dropdown/etc.
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This is genuinely shocking that Apple is not handling that. Talk about quite a decline in one of their flagship products.
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You're shocked that the company which released iOS 26 and macOS 26 to great fanfare, despite it being chock full of visual glitches, some of which hobbled core functionality, and have still not been fixed or even addressed by the third point release, is not handling this?

My personal winner is breaking Mail on the iPad mini: the message list and window have now been set to a bizarre fixed width. On the Mini's smaller screen every single subject line is truncated in portrait mode.

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My workaround was to restore pre-notch behaviour by picking a resolution from the "show all resolutions" list that is conveniently+ exactly screen res height minus notch height.

I theoretically "lose" that much height but gain a) zero notch b) non-rounded top corners and c) a traditionally heighted menubar instead of the giant one that is so big only to cater for the notch.

+ I thought this was thanks to BetterDisplay but it turns out no third party tool is needed and it's all first party probably because someone at Apple is as annoyed by the notch as I was and so that's their solution.

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I think it is because they want to send to apps resolution list that includes or excludes the notch area to choose from for full screen modes (eg in games). Selecting "show all resolutions" basically shows this list.
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Hasn't menu bar applets crowding with no official overflow menu been a problem with MacOS with an obvious solution (add an overflow menu) for... 2+ decades now? I know third party solutions exist and it's kind of an edge case, but still, I remember encountering this back in the day on my ancient plastic Macbook.
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It's much worse than it used to be. Before it was only really a problem with apps with a lot of menus, and you could access the items by switching to an app with fewer of them. Now, the notch takes up a lot of space, and you hit it really soon on a 14" display—I can only have maybe three third party menu applets on top of my collection of built-in ones before they disappear into the notch.
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I think it's not just the notch, but that menu bar icons are more widely spaced than they used to be. I want to say it happened around Sonoma (10.14)? I was working on a Mac app at the time. Icon styles went from dense with a generally square clickable area to widely spaced, wide rectangular clickable area, and a highlight with rounded corners when clicked.
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I have a 16 inch and even I moved to the “no notch” resolution last year because a ton of apps don’t let you choose whether to have a menu icon, and many of them are required corporate crapware. Apple should have bought Bartender and made it part of the OS 10 years ago, or at least before shipping this stupid notch. Apple’s “we know what you need better than you do” approach is so exhausting.
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macOS UI/UX has been declining at an accelerating pace with each new version.

My only hope at this point is it gets _so_ bad it becomes an absolute meme and they get around to fixing it.

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From what I can tell, OS X is no longer one of their flagship products.
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they kindamostly cared when it was OS X. everything's been a bit of a mess since it became macOS while trying to make a unified platform for all their hardware
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iOS is a POS too, now.
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With some apps, I can't remember if tailscale is one I don't think so but another vpn we use is, it's even worse because opening them only creates the menubar icon. I spent 15 minutes trying to figure out why the vpn wouldn't start before I realised it was just hidden. No feedback at all
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It's not even an edge case. It should have been considered an inevitable case.

Really depressing design dereliction and/or incompetence.

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If you're visually impaired, you can hit it even with just a few icons on a 14" laptop. Fonts anything other than tiny + overloaded menus + even a handful of app icons means I always hit this unless I'm docked.

Hacky menu bar modification tools are basically an accessibility requirement for me, and my vision isn't even that bad. (Best corrected is 20/30 or 20/40 or so.) People with serious impairments are totally screwed by this on macOS, sometimes even with large external monitors.

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I run into it when using Rider. I have text size increased on my Macbook and Rider has 8000 menu items, so my menu icons (all of which are default macOS, no third-party stuff) will be hidden to make room for Rider's stuff. I have to switch over to another workspace or window (i.e. away from Rider) if I want to access one of them. It's annoying but I'm not sure who I blame here; Rider I guess, for having a zillion menu items.

Screenshot: https://imgur.com/8y0QbZN

The gap between "Run" and "Tests" is the notch, which I don't usually notice is there unless I'm in Rider.

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Why not blame Apple for having a busted-ass menu bar design? The behavior of "if the menu is busy, icons just disappear" and advice like "apps shouldn't rely on menu bar icons" are just bad ideas. They don't work well with how people use computers or how developers write apps. It's a bad design.
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Yeah, I was surprised that something this obvious wasn't addressed.

Investing in a visual redesign (Liquid Glass) but not an obvious UX issue of the notch hiding icons seems like a mis-prioritization.

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Yes it is genuinely infuriating that this is the case for a company that for so long was praised for their superior UX.

This along with the tons of other paper cuts they've slacked on is tarring their brand.

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It was Windows 7 when Microsoft added an overflow for tray icons, not XP.
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Not true. XP had a feature to set each icon to always show, “automatically,” or never. Will send you screenshots if you demand them, when I get home to my XP ThinkPad.
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Just take Ice's source and have Claude whip you up the features you want. Keep it to yourself. Takes an afternoon and doesn't have other people calling you a sloplogist.

https://github.com/jordanbaird/Ice

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It is ! I’m “solving” it with an app called bartender. It’s hacked and sometimes doesn’t work but was the only way I could manage this problem…

Apple software sucks so bad!

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To be clear: this is not really new with the notch. It's been menu bar icon behavior for decades where if there isn't enough space for all the menus plus menu icons, menu icons disappear with no way to get to them. The notch just acts like the last menu item now (albeit even if there's space between the last menu item and the notch, for applications without a ton of menus).

And yes, it's completely bizarre that macOS doesn't provide an overflow menu. Instead, again yes for decades, you've had to buy/use something like Bartender for this. It is utterly bizarre and inexplicable.

With Tahoe, Apple has finally provided a half-solution, which is that in System Settings you can entirely hide select running menubar utilities to regain some space. But of course that's only helpful for utilities you never need to look at or click.

tl;dr: yes this is utterly absurd but it's been absurd for decades. It's nothing to do with recent versions of macOS.

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One of the mentioned apps, Bartender, was sold to a third party [0].

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40584606

I think they've cleaned it up since then [1], but in the age of supply chain attacks, very concerning. Personally, even as a paying user of Bartender, I moved to the open source solution, at least I can watch the github for changes.

[1] https://www.macbartender.com/b5blog/Lets-Try-This-Again/

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The other mentioned app, Ice, is unmaintained and no longer works on Tahoe. There's a maintained fork called Thaw.
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Thanks, I'll check out Thaw. I've been using Ice without problems:

https://github.com/jordanbaird/Ice/releases/tag/0.11.13-dev....

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> I know software quality has been going down in recent versions of macOS

Note that this particular problem has existed for well over a decade. It's atrocious, but let's not pretend it's anything new.

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The macbook notch has existed for a decade?
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No, menu bar items being hidden when there are too many of them has happened for a decade.

The notch has just made menu bar space more scarce than it used to be.

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If you opened an app like Xcode with a lot of menus options, it would extend beyond across the screen and cover up your menu bar icons.

If I open Xcode today on a 14" MacBook, two menu items extend past the notch, and they still hide your menu bar icons.

This has been the case for a long long time, and it's always been an obvious failure case.

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Menu bar icons overflowing. The notch just makes it a problem quicker, and in an exciting new way.
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Yes, it's terrible and something even Windows handles better. It's one of those utterly bizarre Apple things which make me wonder which old product guy has dirt on everyone else at the company.
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