`ei fylke er alltid ["Vestland", "Rogaland", "Troms", "Finnmark"]`
which on second thought suggests that we can just have `alltid` as a const-modifier on `er`. Simpler.
Another point to note is that Norwegian does not allow the Oxford comma; correct grammar is "Johan, Fredrik og Martin". To follow this rule you should require the last separator of a list to be 'og':
`ei fylke er alltid ["Vestland", "Rogaland", "Troms" og "Finnmark"]`
> `ei fylke er alltid ["Vestland", "Rogaland", "Troms" og "Finnmark"]`
Might even consider adding that.
I have renamed the "endreleg" since the article release to "låst" and "open".
The thought process was:
- Variabelen er låst for endringer.
- Variabelen er open for endringer.
But I really like the "alltid" suggestion.
I like that - much shorter and also the two keywords are the same length, which is always nice when you're making a list. I have to say I would prefer 'åpen', though, just to make extra trouble for people who don't have a keyboard with Correct letters on it. :D
A further thought on `alltid` - you could add the keyword `aldri`, which makes it a runtime error for the variable to take that value. Maybe add ranges as well, for easy bounds checking, e.g.
``` en peker er aldri = null en indeks er aldri > 5 ```
open peker er 10
peker er aldri < 5
peker er aldri > 10
// Masse kode
peker er 30 // Error
open peker er 10
peker er aldri < 5 eller > 10
// Masse kode
peker er 30 // Errorhttps://ordbokene.no/nob/nn/ellers
I think I also saw "ikke" in there.
And https://ordbokene.no/nob/nn/endreleg isn't a word in any language? The Nynorsk word for it is sadly just "variabel". To make it more interesting, you could require agreement, and instead of "endreleg fart", how about just using the indefinite article for things that are changeable since things that are changeable seem kind of indefinite:
ei fart = 70
eit smell = "bang"
eit fag = "naturfag"
ein slutt = "."
forKvar fart
forKvar slutt
forKvart smell
forKvart fag
I have replaced endreleg with "open", and the immutable variable with "open" in later versions (done after the article).
So now the "endreleg" is less of an annoyance, both because it no longer exists and because it has the same number of characters as the immutable keyword.
Some examples to illustrate:
tiedosto on "foo.txt" avattuna
tulostin on PRN1
kirjoita(tiedostoon, "a")
kirjoita(tulostimelle, "b")
syöte olkoon vakiosyöte
yritä
tee syötteen kullekin alkiolle:
käsittele(alkio)
paitsi poikkeustilanteessa liukulukuylivuoto:
kirjoita(virhetulosteeseen, "liukulukuylivuoto")
muutoin:
kirjoita(virhetulosteeseen, "odottamaton poikkeus")https://metacpan.org/dist/Lingua-Romana-Perligata/view/lib/L...
Very, very few. I used to, as a side effect of being quite asocial and reading a lot as a child, and reinforced by my dads very conservative dialect for western Oslo despite where we were living (half an hour drive out the other side of Oslo; dialects in Norway are very local - in that span you pass through at least one other dialect area). The dialect differences were significant enough that an exchange student in high school who was speaking close to perfect Norwegian toward the end of the year still struggled to understand me.
But even then, I adopted more and more of the regional dialect over time. Unless you're a hermit it's hard not to. And there are basically no place in Norway where the local dialect is pure Bokmål.
There might well be more people who can switch to speak pure Bokmål than Nynorsk, though, because it is the primary written language of far more people, and so its the easiest to slip into if you want to speak "formal" Norwegian. This was more pronounced before, when there was a tendency to see the written languages, and especially Bokmål, as more prestigious, and so you might hold a speech in Bokmål instead of your own dialect, TV presenters favoured "pure" Bokmål or Nynorsk instead of their dielcts etc. That's thankfully changed
Having grown up in Norway and seen first hand how it was treated that way.
> You don’t respect the other form enough to cognize that it exists.[1]
I don't like Nynorsk, sure, but that has zero relevance to the point I made, which was if anything a point of contention for those who do like Nynorsk for decades, and a subject of intense activism.
EDIT: You seem to think that I am suggesting that makes one better than the other, or that it should be that way. Neither is the case - there's a reason I wrote "That's thankfully changed". But it was very much the case up until at least the 1980's that Bokmål was treated more favourably than Nynorsk in all kinds of contexts. E.g. companies expecting communication with customers should be done in Bokmål, for example, was an actual thing.
In Oslo.
> I don't like Nynorsk, sure,
That’s not what respect or disrespect is about.
> but that has zero relevance to the point I made,
No. The relevance is what I stated, in the next sentence that you did not quote.
> which was if anything a
What I questioned was its truthfulness. Not what kind of person would say it.
> You seem to think that I am suggesting that makes one better than the other, or that it should be that way.
I did not state or think that you were making a normative statement.
> But it was very much the case up until at least the 1980's that Bokmål was treated more favourably than Nynorsk in all kinds of contexts. ...
Being used more including being dictated from some top-down direction does not necessarily have anything to do with prestige and could be entirely prosaic.
You can question the truthfulness all you want.
It doesn't change the fact that this has been a well established aspect of the language struggle in Norway for well over a century, to the point that when I went to school it was even covered in history lessons.
I'm mystified with how you are ignorant of this. Bokmål has it's origin firmly in being derived from Danish via Riksmål, as based on how the elites spoke.
The spread of Bokmål was a direct consequence of its prestige as a consequence of for a very long time being the favoured written language of the elite, leading to adoption even in areas where the spoken dialect was closer to Nynorsk.
I sense that you are trying to imply that I am applying some kind of value judgement in recognising what people have historically found prestigiuous.
If so you are completely missing the point.
What is prestigious is an empirical question.
It’s very delicious.
I was ecstatic when I found it quite a few years ago in a regular store. A Norwegian friend of mine used to send me a brick of this cheese once a year for Christmas, when I was a student, and I treasured it as one of the most valuable possessions :)
Also, fun fact - the reason this cheese tastes sweet is due to caramelization - the milk gets boiled for a long time (hours) to get the brown color and sweetness. So it’s completely natural, zero added sugar ;)
endreleg fart er 80
endrelig fart blir 80
fart blir 90
Now it is "låst" and "open", as in:
låst fart er 80
open fartsgrense er 110
I don't disagree with you per se, but I think we can look at it another way: See assignments as statements of fact. The sky is blue. Himmelen er blå.
aka himmelen er blå. A statement of fact.
Also, "blir" becomes yet another keyword. More keywords, more to remember. Not that this has been a real consideration or worry in Brunost so far. The design so far is very much "What I felt was okay that day".
I do agree with the fact that this reads nicely:
open fart er 80
fart blir 50This makes sense in functional languages where variables can't change, but not in imperative languages like Brunost. When a fact changes halfway the story, it wasn't much of a fact. Himmelen er blå, inntil den blir rosa.
I too like your final example.
<3
I'm sold.
Now, as for the Danish room mate, he might as well have been speaking Greek.
Danish is if anything ever so slightly closer to German in vocabulary and grammar, but the pronunciation is another matter.
The effect is bigger in writing. In high school I worked my way through Faust in German by finding an old Danish translation as a parallel text - the old Danish version was a decent halfway point when I struggled too much with the German, and helped me find similarities I wouldn't otherwise.
Case in point:
Maybe I should throw that into the language somewhere.
10/10
I would want something that compiles down to something, not interpreted, typesafe, with a proper package manager, etc.
My initial goal was always to take it far enough to do file I/O and sockets, so I could make a Brunost website in Brunost.
If there is interest in the language from the POV of education and so forth I'd be happy to tailor it away from goofs and gafs and into something a little more usable, but I don't want the language to become a full-on production language.
The examples have nothing to do with quick flatulence.
"Now, the keyword fast here is saying that the variable fart cannot be changed - it is immutable"
So would this be the same 'fast' as you'd find in 'steadfast' or as in stuck?
I got annoyed that "fast" and "endreleg" have different numbers of characters (regardless of whether endreleg is nynorsk. I got a 2 in Nynorsk in school, so........)
Now it is "open" and "låst".
As in:
- Variabelen er open for endringer.
- Variabelen er låst for endringer.
I've made my own hell with this language.
Brunost is just me throwing syntax at the wall to make a "nynorsk programming language". Less about careful design and more about getting something to work.
If I were to make a language intended for an important production system, it would be a compiled language that (probably) would go the Gleam route and compile to JS and some other language, while also being typesafe, having a package manager and so forth.
The source was saved tokenized, so the program would have different keywords when loaded in different version of Word. I don't know if there was a Nynorsk version, but I presume there must have been.
(I once had a contract where I spent the first week sorting out problems caused by someone managing to move Word Basic from a Danish version of Word to a Norwegian version untokenised; the problem being of course that the Danish and Norwegian keywords had a lot of overlap, read just fine to a Norwegian reader, but there were differences and so everything broken and the original Word Basic files were not available to me so I couldn't just load that into Norwegian Word... Fun times. This was also the first time I had ever seen Word Basic, after confidently telling the recruiter that of course I knew it, as I was desperate to land the contract - in the end I finished ahead of time, so it was all good)
``` fast fartsgrense er 80 fast minFart er 90
```