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The same can be said about Apple. Several companies have complained about them taking a meeting with apple, presenting their product, only to have Apple then rip it off and build it in house. To say nothing of sherlocking.
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As an old timer, I saw this firsthand happen with Motorola. Apple did the same shenanigans, stealing IP and engineers. I doubt the iPhone would have happened otherwise.

Jobs was absolutely ruthless and would do anything for his goals.

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Presenting a product prototype or idea at a meeting is vastly different from an ex-employee stealing corporate secrets - to me at least.
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Eh, I don't think Apple is particularly ethical or anything (I very much dislike their app store policies), but if you have to choose between two devils Apple is vastly preferable because they're not after my data or my job.
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I always wonder why this long-supported theme doesn’t get more mindshare amid tech commenters’ worship at the altar of Apple.
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"Good artists copy; great artists steal" - Pablo Picasso, but was also used by Steve Jobs, ironically.
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I’m not one to defend huge companies, but OpenAI is a huge company.

It’s possible this kind of behavior is endorsed throughout, or it’s possible it’s limited to this specific group.

We know nothing beyond what Apple has alleged.

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I’ve been at companies where just one group - or even just one person - did something unconscionable and kept getting away with it until the story hit the headlines. And I can tell you, it was never just an isolated incident involving just that group. It’s also all the people who knew something was up and didn’t say anything. And it’s the corporate leadership fostering a pervasive culture of turning a blind eye to ethical problems. Often by allowing people in power to ensure that sounding the alarm is a career-limiting move.
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It very well could be a culture issue.

If it is, would you extend your opinion to say Apple turns a blind eye to ethical issues as well?

All of the employees divulging secrets came from Apple after all. The person named in the lawsuit was a 24 year Apple veteran and a VP at departure.

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It sounds more like they were kept in check at Apple and when they left they showed their true color
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VP is a leadership position, and has significant influence over the culture
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Pointing out it cuts both ways doesn’t imply that it doesn’t cut one of the ways.
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> It’s possible this kind of behavior is endorsed throughout

> It very well could be a culture issue

I agree

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> It’s possible this kind of behavior is endorsed throughout, or it’s possible it’s limited to this specific group.

As others have pointed out elsewhere this is literally the type of behavior OpenAI is founded on. Gathering up other people's IP and using it to build their own thing. It's how all the big LLMs are built.

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You think the group tasked with developing whatever hardware device they're trying to build is isolated away from senior leadership and is running rogue?
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Why not? It may be the old plausable denable thing. Like so many examples. Pressure from the top but no instruction to do $badthing.
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I think it would be hard to argue Sam didn't know anything about it after the Jony Ive + Sam Altman love videos about their hardware project
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We need to take a peek at their diaries again
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Not being able to prove is one thing, pretending it may not be the case is next level of positivity. There are definitely going to be pockets of hard working smart folks in every place, however the company as a whole would get a bad name even if few folks are indulged and the company is not doing anything about it.
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Do you know who the CEO is?
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Same thought I had, I realized I was zero percent surprised reading the claims made, it feels like a perfect representation of the personality Sam Altman shows the world.
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Are you joking or are you confusing huge valuations with huge headcount?
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OpenAI had >5000 employees last year. How many work in the hardware group?
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This is only like the 12th reason not to trust OpenAI. The culture starts from the top
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You can trust Apple. I mean they openly lied to a judge last year under oath, but you can trust them.
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I'm the farthest thing from an Apple fanboi you can find, but Apple's not so unethical as to make all this (OpenAI trade secret) stuff up. The OpenAI settlement they'll no doubt get from this won't amount to 30 days of their App Store rent-seeking that they were propping up with those lies.

If they can't prove any of this stuff they wouldn't file the suit. No matter what you or I think of Apple, the chances that this went down at least as criminally as they allege, are very high.

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> Apple's not so unethical

Apple colluded with other companies to suppress wages.

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Apple earned some trust unlike openai.
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Can you provide a source? Otherwise your comment is useless.
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Judge's ruling.

> To hide the truth, Vice-President of Finance, Alex Roman, outright lied under oath. Internally, Phillip Schiller had advocated that Apple comply with the Injunction, but Tim Cook ignored Schiller and instead allowed Chief Financial Officer Luca Maestri and his finance team to convince him otherwise. Cook chose poorly. The real evidence, detailed herein, more than meets the clear and convincing standard to find a violation. The Court refers the matter to the United States Attorney for the Northern District of California to investigate whether criminal contempt proceedings are appropriate.

> [..]

> Neither Apple, nor its counsel, corrected the, now obvious, lies. They did not seek to withdraw the testimony or to have it stricken (although Apple did request that the Court strike other testimony). Thus, Apple will be held to have adopted the lies and misrepresentations to this Court.

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.cand.36...

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This thread is certainly achieving Apple's PR goals
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Meh. Consider that you had no choice and no say that your data out there, both present and historic as mined, aggregated and analyzed by data collectors, was used as a training set for the LLMs. I think you’re a tad too late with your warning. They’re already thieves and they know it. And they know you can’t and won’t do anything about it.
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Public/crawlable data is very different from private/internal documents and code that employees might prompt with.
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> A company that behaves like this in one area, cannot be trusted in any area.

A company locking down their phone platform cannot be trusted with their laptop OS.

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