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Mostly the curse of the first mover, with a dash of corruption for spice.

Part of it is "the curse of good enough": the US has had good credit-card style infrastructure for over a century and digital infrastructure since the POTS days. Part of it is that we lost our appetite for anti-trust in the 80s. Part of it is that the price structure of this infrastructure has wormed its way into everything in a way that is difficult to undo without causing high-visibility inconvenience for low-visibility benefit. The good-enough is the enemy of the good.

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I think it's mainly because they aren't forced by regulation.

Germany is another first mover with decades old banking systems and standards. German banks also dragged their feet supporting SEPA Instant or they added additional fees so that barely anybody wanted to use it.

Then the EU stepped in with regulation: If you support classic SEPA transactions, you also have to support SEPA Instant for the same price (which is almost always free for retail banking accounts). And suddenly banks did.

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Yes, this could be fixed with regulation -- but whoever did the regulation would have to contend with angry fools complaining about how "the government took away my credit card rewards!!!" for years and of course the credit card companies themselves would stir and amplify those voices as much as possible.
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> the price structure of this infrastructure has wormed its way into everything in a way that is difficult to undo without causing high-visibility inconvenience for low-visibility benefit

I think the “recent” change allowing merchants to pass along the credit card fees is a step in the right direction.

I think a lot of people would still choose fraud protection for the extra costs, though.

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The US also has incredibly pro-consumer regulation over credit cards, compared to most of the world. There is no such thing as "not protecting your card" as a way for the bank to get out of paying for credit card fraud. Legally, you are liable for the first $50 of unauthorized charges, and that's it (though most cards will cover all of it).
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> The US also has incredibly pro-consumer regulation over credit cards

Not to take away from your example, but I was under the impression that transaction fees charged when using a credit card in the US were significantly more than in say, the EU?

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They are. It is a modest price to pay for legal protection at that level.
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In what world is 2-3% of every payment "modest", when actual fraud losses are an order of magnitude below that?
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The consumer reaps the benefits, but the 2-3% is charged to the merchant and the consumer gets some of that back as rewards points/cashback/etc.

Of course the business passes its costs right back to the consumer, but it's not visible to them, while the benefits are.

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Australia recently capped credit card fees. Yes, it has lead to a decline in credit points/cashback but in the end it's leaving more money in your pocket.
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Exactly, but a hidden cost is still a cost.
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Also: if the merchant does not offer a cash discount, it's not the card user that's paying the cost.
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Of course they still are. Just because you can't avoid paying a cost doesn't mean you're not paying it.
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Payment processors and banks lobby for control over this. As usual, a service/product is bad because no one is allowed to create a better alternative, this is an almost universal rule. Specific to this case: the government is included in the list of parties not allowed to make it better.
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> the government is included in the list of parties not allowed to make it better.

The government is the only one capable of changing the rules to be included in the list of allowed parties to make it better.

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And the only ones capable of making the government change these rules are the oligarchs who pay them to change the rules.
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Do you mean in Canada or is this also the case in the US?
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Mostly deficiencies of the political system: regulators see themselves, call themselves and act like "watchdogs", whereas in other countries financial regulators act like shepherds and lead the market. Hence in this country relatively minor players with interests not exactly aligned with the general public can hijack the process. That's what we are witnessing.
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Banks earn money on card payments and pay (via explicit fees or implicit fraud liability without compensation) for interbank transfers, so without any external forcing function (market or regulatory), it seems pretty clear to me why they prefer one over the other.
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Not real time, but ACH is being forcibly sped up by regulators. [0]

> All U.S. financial institutions (Receiving Depository Financial Institutions or RDFIs) must participate and accept Same Day ACH credit transactions.

> However, sending (originating) Same Day ACH payments is optional for banks and credit unions.

[0]: https://www.nebankmn.com/assets/files/aijt34yD

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That's great, but $1 per transaction makes same day ACH tough for small transactions
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$1 is not market.

I've signed up for or seen the contracts for several payment processors across several companies. Rack rate for ACH debit starts at $0.25/trx and goes down to sub-penny at scale. Returns can be high though ($2 per, going down as well).

Edited to add: that's not a defense, I *loathe* ACH. It's a negative-reporting system which is such a pain to deal with.

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My understanding is that sameday ACH does not cost extra (from a network perspective) than regular ACH, it's just that some shitty banks apparently like to charge extra for it.
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Outside the AI summaries, I couldn’t easily find the sources. But a couple of different sources say same-day ACH is 5.2 cents per outgoing item while overnight is 0.35 cents.

What I can say is the Fed has draconian rules for pricing its services. The services cannot be subsidized but must be priced to recover costs, including a return on capital similar to what a private payment system (ie from the Clearinghouse) would expect.

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This seems to be the official pricing info: https://www.frbservices.org/resources/service-fees/ach-2026/

I read it as the sending institution pays 5.2 cents to the receiving institution per item, on top of the 0.35c/item + 0.1c/item same-day surcharge for a maximum of 5.65 cents/item before volume discounts.

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Our federal representatives are mostly incompetent and technologically illiterate. When a large project does materialize, the funding is wasted on contractors who actively scam the government.
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I think it’s the general desire for a “smaller” Federal government that instead relies on private sector solutions.

For other examples, look at adoption of login.gov vs id.me, and tax filing software solutions.

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Why would a Montenegro ID site have anything to do with the us?
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Haha I don’t know ask the IRS, VA, and SSA, among other U.S. federal agencies.
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Ah, login.gov, that perfectly reasonable thing that USDS and 18F built, before Elon Musk and his DOGE minions de-staffed both departments. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/18F#Mass_firings_and_eliminati... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Digital_Service#...

Because why would Musk possibly be interested in saving money and making the government run more efficiently?

What an egotistical ass hat.

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In most part of the world, the government just force the bank to join the payment system and restrict how they charge the customer.

In the USA, no single regulator have that power. Basically only congress can do something like this. The us Congress ain't famous for being fast, you know.

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The Fed prints a fraction of a fraction of the actual money in circulation. Private banks in practice control the money supply. As such, they want to maintain their monopoly.

The countries that have innovated the most in regards to automated payments are the ones trying to escape US influence: look at PIX in Brazil, BRICS pay, etc...

In America, the payment system is an oligarchy, they protect their own (the bankers), what need is there for innovation when they are making a killing out of the current inefficiency?

The one place where the US haven't been slow is in stablecoins, making them dollar donominated, to ensure the monopoly the US dollar has on international trade stays strong. That way, when the US has a crisis, they take down the rest of the world too, to the joy of non-US countries.

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It does. Outdated information RTP is what its called
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Sounds great. How do I pay using RTP at the grocery store or at online merchants?
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Lobbying?
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Venmo, CashApp, Apple Pay, and Zelle are free for person to person transactions and you get the cash in your account the following day.

I’ve never been in a position where I needed a cash transfer to an account the very same day, I have tens of thousands of dollars of credit available so there’s very little need for immediate transfers, at least for me personally. I do virtually all of my spending on credit cards so I have up to 60 days to pay the loan back without interest.

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Ever buy something from a rando, or split the bill with a colleague or friend?With real time transactions, you can confirm that you actually received the money immediately.
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Zelle is ACH, everyone else uses card processing rails. It's not the same as real instant transfers between banks. There are middlemen involved that don't need to be there.
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Others have pointed out that we do have this and there are some reasons it's not the same scale as credit card infrastructure, but I'll just observe there's a cultural difference

We've had a billion discussions on Hacker News about payment rails and it's invariably always a European incredulous that Americans can't/won't do a digital payment instantly and for pennies. These Europeans are typically operating with a mental model where they have cash in a bank account and every transaction gets funded from cash on hand.

Americans - for better or for worse - want longer cycles to pay for their charges and many want rewards for their spend. I don't think it's uncharitable to describe those who pull out debit over credit during a transaction as lower income and higher credit risk than those who prefer credit. (Europeans will decry that this is Americans living beyond their means. Maybe! Maybe.)

But when it comes to business, I've never understood this argument from Europeans. Invoicing works on net-30/60/90 terms. In B2B payments you could reduce payment cost by doing invoicing with instant low-cost payment in 30 days, but incur a different "cost" in cash flow management. Credit card payments are a risk-based financial product that does a magic trick of arbitrage for merchants between a service/good sold and payment received as a net-30 invoice to the cardholder, and you should expect to pay a fee for that. An economy where businesses need to pay each other immediately out of cash-on-hand is less dynamic and less efficient than one where all that cash flow can get smoothed out via payment intermediaries. (Money you have to keep on hand for bills is not being deployed doing other things in the economy - this is inefficient!)

For C2B payments, this is probably a helpful and lower-cost innovation over debit rails. But credit is a different product, financially and culturally, in the United States.

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